Hi everybody!!

Introduce yourself, share your heroic Zephyr tales, put the world to rights, gossip, etc.

Re: Hi everybody!!

Postby Ivor » 20 Feb 2019, 22:13

Lovely bike and for me I like higher bars :) sorry to hear about your mum .. and a 500 tripple .. What a woman :)
tapeworms are hungry pets !
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Re: Hi everybody!!

Postby Silverkap » 20 Feb 2019, 22:42

Thanks Ivor! I like them too but I need more space for the arms...

Image


A comparison between my two bikes...a huge difference!!! (I don't know why the pics are always cut...)

Image
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Re: Hi everybody!!

Postby Silverkap » 24 Feb 2019, 14:58

Yesterday I went to a Kawasaki store...I decided to do a lot of works on the bike:

- new handlebar
- take away the grid that is on the radiator
- new rear shocks
- full engine check + oil, filters...
- new forks oil
- new brake oil
- I will turn the eccentric in order to make the rear higher. At the moment as soon as you turn...you touch the ground
- I also bought a second hand seat to be modified

...again a lot of money...

Then I will check the new position and if it will still be not enough, I will buy the pegs.
Last edited by Silverkap on 25 Feb 2019, 07:52, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Hi everybody!!

Postby 750R » 24 Feb 2019, 17:32

don't turn the eccentric and use longer rear Shocks - the Drive Chain will kill your Swingarm!
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Re: Hi everybody!!

Postby ZR468 » 24 Feb 2019, 17:36

You looked cramped on the Zephyr the way it is. I hope the end result will work for you. If you are changing your handle bar, I might buy those high bars off you.
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Re: Hi everybody!!

Postby Silverkap » 24 Feb 2019, 18:12

750R wrote:don't turn the eccentric and use longer rear Shocks - the Drive Chain will kill your Swingarm!



Why?
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Re: Hi everybody!!

Postby Freddy » 24 Feb 2019, 22:54

Silverkap wrote:
Image


I'm sort of not surprised the bike drags in corners based on how it looks in the above picture. Now it may just be camera angle etc, but to me the bike looks way low in the back.

Are they the original Kawasaki shocks on the bike, or have they been changed? If they've been changed the first thing I'd do is confirm the eye to eye distance is correct. If all that checks out ok, next set both the front and rear rider sag. If your looking to maximize ground clearance, set free sag at about 5mm and then check the rider sag is somewhere in the ball park.

Still no good. Change to dual-rate rear springs. Because you can run a heavier section that would otherwise beat you to death if it was all one linear spring, the stronger section will stop the rear suspension compressing so much in turns. But if you're contemplating this, just buy top line shocks with height adjustment that will come with dual-rate springs and adjustable low/high speed compression (this will also make a difference).

P.S. You can't just turn the chain adjuster upside down if an 1100 is anything like a 750. The chain where it goes over the front of the swingarm will drag big time. Even if it didn't drag you also can't change the chain pull angle, and swing arm angle, and front suspension 'trail' by this amount without affecting the bikes handling. Just changing the rear sprocket size is enough to alter the squat characteristics of a 200hp sportbike. Imaging what a 25-30mm change might do (even on a modest 93hp bike)

There are plenty of technical articles to be found on the internet that will explain how chain pull angle and swing arm angle affect the squat v anti-squat tendency of a motorcycle, and the importance of this handling characteristic. These are technical design parameters that have been purposely set (hopefully) by the bikes designer. At least understand these issues before contemplating changes. Another thing just jacking up the back 25mm? will do is radically reduce front suspension 'trail'. Again, plenty of technical articles on the internet to explain what happens when you do that.
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Re: Hi everybody!!

Postby 750R » 25 Feb 2019, 19:05

Silverkap wrote:
750R wrote:don't turn the eccentric and use longer rear Shocks - the Drive Chain will kill your Swingarm!


Why?


ans Freddy Said :
Freddy wrote: You can't just turn the chain adjuster upside down if an 1100 is anything like a 750. The chain where it goes over the front of the swingarm will drag big time. Even if it didn't drag you also can't change the chain pull angle, and swing arm angle, and front suspension 'trail' by this amount without affecting the bikes handling. Just changing the rear sprocket size is enough to alter the squat characteristics of a 200hp sportbike. Imaging what a 25-30mm change might do (even on a modest 93hp bike)


The Shocks of your 1100 are the original ones - the Lowering on front and rear comes from the Wheel/tire combination! in Front you run 17" instead of 18" and the rear tire ist changed from 160/70-17 to 180/55-17.
Turning the Eccentric is normally possible on the 1100 if you have enough weight - is has bigger Sprockets

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Re: Hi everybody!!

Postby Freddy » 26 Feb 2019, 00:18

750R wrote:
The Shocks of your 1100 are the original ones - the Lowering on front and rear comes from the Wheel/tire combination! in Front you run 17" instead of 18" and the rear tire ist changed from 160/70-17 to 180/55-17.
Turning the Eccentric is normally possible on the 1100 if you have enough weight - is has bigger Sprockets


Well then rather than potentially adversely altering the bikes geometry and handling by turning over the eccentric (it will significantly alter the chain pull angle and swing arm angle) wouldn't the first thing to correct the ground clearance be to fit the correct size rear tire? There's improved handling and a 13mm increase in height right there. https://www.tacomaworld.com/tirecalc?tires=160-70r17-180-55r17

Then I'll bet the rider sag has never been set. There's probably another 10mm, even more.

Then swap out the linear rate springs for dual rate springs. Not only will you get easily another 10 to 20mm ground clearance in the corners, the bike will ride softer in a straight line (because it'll be running on a lighter spring rate than OEM when vertical), but be more 'solid' and corner better as it compresses down onto the stronger than OEM spring rate part of the dual rate spring in corners. Just about every 'retro racer' will have dual rate springs on their twin shock race bike these days, and that's on relatively smooth race tracks. There is a reason, and that is you can run a heavier rate spring where you want it (in corners, more 'solid', not as compressed, better ground clearance) than you otherwise could. A pair of linear rate springs of that weight would beat you to death on the bumps going down the straights. All modern bikes these days (well anything half decent) have progressive rate rear suspensions to support the bike in corners, but I digress.

So what height improvement am I up to now? 13+10+15 = 38mm, and still with the chain pull and swing arm angles the designer intended. And I still have the option of another 5mm increase by fitting decent shocks with height adjustment. Result: A potential 42mm height increase (which is probably about 20-25mm at the foot peg to road when over at a 45 degree angle) and a way better handling bike.

Sorry, turning the eccentric over should be considered as the very last resort, not the first. It's a 'band aid' solution (could have worded that differently, but I'm being diplomatic). Correct the issues that are causing the problem in the first place.
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Re: Hi everybody!!

Postby Freddy » 26 Feb 2019, 03:40

Regarding this idea of fitting dual rate springs to improve ground clearance in corners, this is what the real serious crew do. They don't use a single dual-rate spring at all. What they do is stack two different rate linear springs one on top of the other. Infinite more tuning variables than being constrained by the quite linted range of dual rate springs with fixed ratios that are available.

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